Should Women Preach?


Sermon Transcript/Article: Should Women Preach?
 
By Shari Hole

Introduction

Should women be allowed to preach? I told myself that I wasn’t going to speak about this topic again. But I can’t help myself. It’s one of the most debated subjects among Christians. This topic is more popular than the subject of gay marriage. It is the most popular question at the Christian website  gotquestions.org. Should Women Preach? was the most viewed post on my blog. Since I wrote it in May of 2008 it has had 17,565 page views. I can’t believe it. When I wrote it, I did my best. But in the past 7 years, I have learned more and fine-tuned my view, so I’m doing a revision to that post.

You see, when I was a kid, I didn’t realize that “women preaching” was an issue. I grew up going to a church where I saw both men and women equally participating in all aspects of the church. In fact, every Sunday night, I heard a woman preach at our church. I grew up thinking that women could be just as knowledgeable and wise about spiritual issues as men. In my childhood church the men didn’t appear to feel threatened by the women and the women didn’t appear to be overstepping any bounds. It seemed like they all just worked well together. But then I became an adult and I realized that this is a real controversial issue.


What People Are Saying
 
I decided that I wanted to speak on this subject, because it is actually a serious problem in the Christian church. People have become hurt, frustrated, angry, and divided over whether or not women should preach about God. That’s not what Jesus wants for us. Jesus wants Christians to encourage one another in the faith, and in ministry, and for us to live in unity with each other. Paul reiterated this to the Christians in 1 Thessalonians 5:11 when he wrote “Therefore encourage one another and build each other up, just as in fact you are doing.” But a lot of Christians sharing their opinions on this subject have not done so in a spiritually encouraging way.

I’m going to refer back to the blog post that I wrote in May 2008. In that post, I supported the idea that women should preach and I received 62 comments about it. All of them were strongly opinionated and many of them were down right rude and hurtful. But, I thought I’d share a few with you so you can see where people are coming from on this issue.
I’ll start with Louis who said “You have the spirit of Eve. Women are not to teach or preach because they are susceptible to deception.”

Amy said “I commend you for having the courage to write all of that. I love it that my church has allowed women to teach and to be in leadership. Though, sadly, many left over the issue.”

Anonymous said “You are part of the lukewarm Apostate Church. Get right with God now, the time is short.”

There was a woman that said “We just need to be under our husband's spiritual leadership. If your husband believes you should preach, follow him. If he doesn't, then don't.”

Another Anonymous person said “For a woman to hold any office in the church is sinning in pride for self-gratification and should not be permitted.”

Pastor David said “I am preparing a teaching regarding women's ministry and I wholeheartedly believe in the need and right for women to minister.”

Nelly said “The men are to teach and preach the Word, while we as women are to be in subjection to them and to stand behind their backs, praying for them. And I believe this is an honor for us. If a woman were teaching a man he would have a hard time concentrating on the lesson because she was immodestly dressed.”

And Whitney said “The Holy Spirit gives spiritual gifts to everyone, male and female, and one of those gifts is teaching. We certainly can't fathom the mind and thoughts of God, but I don't see why He would call a woman to do something if He wouldn't allow her to do it.”

What are Women Feeling?

Denise George wrote a book called What Women Wish Pastors Knew. In order to write this book she surveyed a variety of Christian women. The results from her survey showed that the majority of the female respondents actually believed that women should be serving in all areas of church leadership and not forbidden from any position. She found that women simply want to serve Christ. But because of the controversy of women in leadership some feel afraid to pursue their call due to being misunderstood. Some experience humiliation because people publicly speak out against their type of ministry. Some feel deprived of serving because although they use their skills in the secular world they are not allowed to use those same skills in their churches. She also found that they feel frustrated, excluded, overlooked, held back, stifled, unimportant, and some feel like second-class citizens.

Why Do Women Want to Preach?

Now, why would a woman even want to preach? Well, maybe it’s for the same reasons that men want to preach. I can tell you about myself. When I write a speech and speak it to other people, I am doing it as an act of worship to God. My Christian faith is important to me. I appreciate the sacrificial death of Jesus and that I have salvation and eternal life through Him. I want to tell other people about this and about how to be a follower of Jesus. When I speak about the Bible I aim to tell only the truth about God’s word. Along with reading Bible commentaries – I try to read the verses in context, to look at the cultural setting and to attempt to understand the author’s original purpose in writing. When I speak, I want to teach people about the attributes of God and point out the exciting things that I see in the Bible. I want to offer ideas to help make the Bible applicable to people so that they can use it in their everyday lives. And when I speak, I try to show compassion and offer real hope to the hurting. I encourage people to serve God and to reach out to people in their communities. I try to speak out against injustice and advocate for the vulnerable. I speak about Jesus, because I enjoy it and I want to glorify him. And these may be some of the reasons why other women want to preach. And these may be some of the reasons why men want to preach.

Are Women to Remain Silent in Church?

The verses that Christians often refer to when debating whether or not women should preach are found in Paul’s letter to the Christians in Corinth. The passage is 1 Corinthians 14:33-35 and it says "The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says. If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church.” (NASB)

Now, these words written in Paul’s letter mean only one thing. But the problem is that theologians, Bible scholars, and preachers can’t agree on what Paul’s original intention was concerning these specific words. As a result there are a variety of interpretations despite the fact that there is only one real meaning. I found that some of the interpretations are vague, some are very specific, and with most of them people add their own ideas to Paul’s original words.

One interpretation is that it was a rule for a specific time and circumstance and so there are now obvious exceptions. However, even though Christianity emancipated women it did not give them equality with men. Another idea is that Paul’s words don’t mean that all speaking by women in a public assembly is prohibited – just preaching, teaching, and prophesying. Women can still share about how God is working in their lives just not in an authoritative manner. There were extraordinary instances when women led spiritually such as with Deborah, Huldah, and Anna, but these were rare cases and must not be used as an example of what the norm should be. One interpretation is that women cannot speak with spiritual authority unless they have an extraordinary revelation to communicate which is given to them by the Holy Spirit. Another idea is that God has ordained men only to have spiritual authority in the church through preaching. However, women may take a less authoritative role by encouraging other women and teaching children. Yet another interpretation states that it is only okay for women to teach or preach indirectly such as through books or audio recordings because if a woman taught in person, her femininity could be a distraction. Some churches won’t allow women to speak from behind the lectern during the official Sunday morning service, but they are allowed to teach and preach in other rooms of the church building at any other time. Other churches will allow a woman to be a guest speaker even on a Sunday morning in front of the entire congregation – as long as it isn’t called preaching. Some simply say that men were called to preach and to be the spiritual leaders, but if they aren’t going to do it than women will have to. Another thought is that this passage of Paul’s was directed only to the Corinthian church. His reasoning was based on a localized cultural issue in which certain women may have been disrupting the church service. And yet another idea is that this passage was actually a quote from the original Corinthian church’s letter that Paul was responding to. The quote reflects the traditional thinking of the Jewish law and that is why Paul’s words that followed this controversial passage in verse 36 states: “Do you think God’s word originated with you Corinthians? Are you the only ones to whom it was given?”

Well, this was just a sample of the various interpretations of this passage of scripture. Most people choose the one that they like best. While some people determine their theological beliefs depending on who said it. I don’t think anyone can say with 100% certainty what Paul really meant. So I am not going to choose one of the previous ideas and promote it as the truth. Instead, I’d like to look at the example of Jesus. We can understand so much more about this subject by looking to Jesus rather than debating Paul’s confusing words.

Looking at the Example of Jesus

Jesus’ relationship with women was considered revolutionary and radical in the Jewish patriarchal society in which women were treated as social and spiritual inferiors to men. Jesus challenged the traditional gender restrictions and cultural taboos. Women were used to being bartered off by their fathers and were considered the property of their husbands. They were not allowed to learn about spiritual truths from the rabbis yet Jesus commended Mary of Bethany for listening to Him and for understanding His teaching that He would die and become the Savior of the world. Women were considered unclean, untouchable, and in need of purification after their monthly cycles and childbirth. Yet Jesus allowed a woman with a 12 year chronic bleeding condition to touch Him. He was so impressed with her faith in Him that He healed her instantly. Jesus forgave the sins of women, like in the case of the woman who was about to be stoned for adultery. Jesus spoke against the men who oppressed and persecuted women for their sins yet weren’t interested in condemning men for the same sins. Jesus asked women to evangelize for Him as seen in the example of the Samaritan woman that He met at a well. He invited women like Mary Magdalene, Joanna, Susanna, and many others to travel with Him as His disciples and to help with His ministry of proclaiming the kingdom of God. After His resurrection, Jesus commissioned Mary Magdalene to go and speak for Him saying that He was returning to God.

Jesus was very liberating for women and he was able to use their services in His ministry. He was impartial and treated them equally which was a foreign concept in their culture. Impartiality is one of God’s attributes. He does not display prejudice towards any person or esteem some as being more important than others. In Acts 10:34 we see that there is no favoritism with God. He accepts people from every nationality and race. Paul reiterates this in Romans 2:11 saying that there is no partiality with God. And Deuteronomy says that He is the great God, mighty and awesome, who shows no partiality and accepts no bribes. It is part of the very nature of Jesus to treat all equally and that is why he did not discriminate concerning a person’s gender, race, nationality, or socioeconomic status.

Paul carried on the example of Jesus and also included women in all aspects of Christian ministry. He told the Christians in Rome to welcome Phoebe as a representative of the church and he endorsed the ministry work that she was doing. He honored his fellow Christian workers Priscilla and her husband Aquila for risking their lives to help him and he mentioned the church they held in their home. Paul appreciated Lois and Eunice, both women, for teaching Timothy spiritual truths that prepared him for Christian ministry. And he recognized the female apostle, Junias, who had been in prison with him. Paul also told the Roman church to say hello to three women who had worked hard for the Lord – Tryphena, Tryphosa, and Persis. In1 Corinthians, Paul talked about Chloe’s church congregation. In Colossians 4 he referred to the congregation of a woman named Nympha. And in Philippians 4, Paul requested help for the two women named Euodia and Syntyche who struggled along with him as they promoted the Gospel of Jesus. Paul appreciated Christian women and the work that they did to spread Christianity through teaching, evangelizing, and preaching about Jesus.

The Gifts of the Holy Spirit for all Believers

What Jesus had to offer was for all. This was explained to us in Galatians 3:28 – “There is no longer Jew or Gentile, slave or free, male and female. For you are all one in Christ Jesus.” In Matthew 28 we see Jesus telling his disciples to continue on with the ministry that He had started. He gave them a commission to go make new disciples of all people and to baptize them in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit. These new Christian disciples included women. And the women were also included with the receiving of the Holy Spirit. This portion of scripture in Acts 1 and 2 tells us that after the ascension of Jesus His followers met in Jerusalem. Among the believers were women which included Mary the mother of Jesus. On the day of Pentecost, they were all together when the Holy Spirit entered the building and filled all of these believers with the Holy Spirit. Then Peter explained to the on looking crowd that what was happening to these followers of Jesus had actually been predicted by the prophet Joel.

This is what Peter said in Acts 2 verses 17 and 18. “‘In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams. Even on my servants, both men and women, I will pour out my Spirit in those days, and they will prophesy.” He said that men and women would be filled with the Holy Spirit and would prophesy.

 And in 1 Corinthians 12:4-13 we learn that the people who are filled with the Holy Spirit receive spiritual gifts to use for Christian ministry. It says “There are different kinds of spiritual gifts, but the same Spirit is the source of them all. There are different kinds of service, but we serve the same Lord. God works in different ways, but it is the same God who does the work in all of us. A spiritual gift is given to each of us so we can help each other. To one person the Spirit gives the ability to give wise advice; to another the same Spirit gives a message of special knowledge.The same Spirit gives great faith to another, and to someone else the one Spirit gives the gift of healing. 10 He gives one person the power to perform miracles, and another the ability to prophesy. He gives someone else the ability to discern whether a message is from the Spirit of God or from another spirit. Still another person is given the ability to speak in unknown languages, while another is given the ability to interpret what is being said. 11 It is the one and only Spirit who distributes all these gifts. He alone decides which gift each person should have. 12 The human body has many parts, but the many parts make up one whole body. So it is with the body of Christ. 13 Some of us are Jews, some are Gentiles, some are slaves, and some are free. But we have all been baptized into one body by one Spirit, and we all share the same Spirit.”


Further down in this chapter Paul explained that all of the believers are a part of Christ’s body. And the parts include apostles, prophets, and teachers, those who do miracles, those who heal, those who help others, leaders, and those who speak in unknown languages. But it doesn’t say anything about all of the spiritual gifts being available to men, but only some of them being available to women

Modern Christian Women

Evangelist Christine Caine had some good advice that she shared in an interview for Christianity Today magazine. She said “The Spirit of God lives within all of us who are born again and out of us will flow rivers of living water if we let them. Let's not clog the rivers up with dead end arguments, and let's simply get about the Father's business.” Christians can keep arguing about the issue of whether or not women should preach or hold positions of leadership in the Christian church. But while we are arguing and trying to prove our points, a world of people still exists that needs to hear about Jesus. So like Christine Caine suggested – let’s just get about doing the Father’s business. What God really wants is for his people to make new disciples. He wants as many people as possible to hear about Him, to receive His salvation, and to make commitments to follow Him.


Throughout history, Christian women have bravely gone against tradition. They preached when they weren’t supposed to. They traveled the world as missionaries even though mission agencies said that they weren’t qualified to go. And women today are still challenging tradition. In China, the majority of Christians worship in house churches rather than the official churches overseen by the government. Many of these house churches are led by women. These house churches are the reason that Christianity is spreading so quickly throughout China. If we encouraged women to be spiritual leaders and to preach in this country, maybe Christianity would spread quicker throughout the United States of America, too. According to the Barna research organization in 1999 5% of the Senior Pastors of Protestant churches were female. It doubled to 10% by 2009. I don’t know the most recent number. But I do know that women are no longer waiting for permission from churches and denominations to preach. They are fed up with being held back by religious tradition, spiritual legalism, and especially by their own fears. It is not spiritual to be passive or content with others telling you what you can and can’t do. Jesus wants you to be ambitious and motivated about serving Him. He wants you to take risks for Him.

Liberty University, the largest Christian university in the world states on their website that the majority of their students, 59%, are female. And if you look around your churches you will notice that the majority of the people who attend and serve are probably female. Women love Jesus. They want to serve Him and they want to lead other people to Him. So let’s encourage women, rather than hold them back because of our traditions. Women have proved that they are capable of serving humanity in the secular world. Women are successfully starting and running businesses, saving lives through health care, teaching in schools and universities, advocating for those who don’t have a voice, and running non-profit organization. Well women can lead in the Christian world, too

Conclusion and Application

To the Christian Women – I want to encourage you to speak out publicly about Jesus your Savior. I think that if you did, Jesus would be very pleased with you. Can you imagine speaking about Jesus and Him saying to you - “Woman, I really wish that you would keep quiet about me. Stop telling others about me. Stop telling people about how I died on the cross for their sins and that I give the free gift of salvation to all who will accept it. Stop reading the Bible in public and sharing your spiritual incite. Stop. I only want men to do this.” No. I cannot imagine Jesus saying such a thing to you.

You are a disciple of Jesus and you have been filled with the Holy Spirit. He already gave you permission to speak about Him. The gifts of the Spirit and the authority to preach about Jesus are for all. Jesus is the great liberator and He is impartial. Our culture and human made religious traditions hold people back and they exclude many. But if you have accepted Jesus as your Savior and Lord than you are allowed to speak, teach, and preach about Him. Men and women are called to preach. All races of people are called to preach. All ages of people are called to preach. Despite all of the human limitations that may be holding you back – Jesus has actually freed you. The message of Jesus is liberating. It provides eternal life for anyone who wants to accept it. Jesus wants it spread to as many people as possible before He returns to this Earth to take His followers to live with Him forever. So, whoever you are – if you are a follower of Jesus, then you have been given the authority and the permission through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit to go preach about Jesus. So the answer is – Yes. Women should preach.



Original post from May 2008
Should Women Preach?

I wonder how many women have been called to preach the Word of God, but are silenced in a church because "women are not supposed to preach".

Here are some of the popular Bible verses used to keep women from preaching in the church:Women should remain silent in the churches.

1 Corinthians 14:33b-35 "The women are to keep silent in the churches; for they are not permitted to speak, but are to subject themselves, just as the Law also says. If they desire to learn anything, let them ask their own husbands at home; for it is improper for a woman to speak in church. (NASB)

The entire chapter of 1 Corinthians 14 is about having order during the worship service so that people will not be distracted from worshiping God. It addresses speaking in tongues, prophecy, and doing things orderly so that the Lord will be edified. When it says "women should remain silent in the churches", it is not talking about preaching. It doesn't say exactly why Paul said this about the Corinthian women. Maybe they were disrupting the service, questioning what was being said, or trying to get attention on themselves. Paul's reasoning was based on a localized cultural issue. Paul also tells the entire Corinthian church to keep silent if there is no interpreter to tongues - 14:28 "But if there is no interpreter, he must keep silent in the church; and let him speak to himself and to God. (NASB) Silence is mentioned again in 14:30 " But if a revelation is made to another who is seated, the first one must keep silent."(NASB) During this chapter, Paul doesn't refer only to women when he talks about being silent in the church.

The Message Version of the Bible explains 1 Corinthians 14:
34-36 this way. "Wives must not disrupt worship, talking when they should be listening, asking questions that could more appropriately be asked of their husbands at home. God's Book of the law guides our manners and customs here. Wives have no license to use the time of worship for unwarranted speaking. Do you—both women and men—imagine that you're a sacred oracle determining what's right and wrong? Do you think everything revolves around you?"

Women are not to teach or have authority over men.
1 Timothy 2:11-15 "A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. But women will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety."Paul was concerned about the Ephesian believers turning to false doctrines and religious beliefs. In 1 Timothy 1:3 Paul is telling Timothy that the Ephesians are not to teach any other doctrine other than the apostle's doctrine. In 1 Timothy 1:4 Paul wanted Timothy to make sure that they didn't get into other beliefs, since Ephesus was a center for different false religions. These other religions, in Ephesus, were being led by women and they involved sexual orgies. The women were deceiving men and drawing them into these false religions. This probably is why Paul had concerns about the women taking over in churches. Paul says in 1 Timothy 2:11 that he wants the Ephesian women to be submissive to the church leaders probably because of the current situations in Ephesus at that time.

The Message Version of the Bible explains
1 Timothy 2:11-15 this way "I don't let women take over and tell the men what to do. They should study to be quiet and obedient along with everyone else. Adam was made first, then Eve; woman was deceived first—our pioneer in sin!—with Adam right on her heels. On the other hand, her childbearing brought about salvation, reversing Eve. But this salvation only comes to those who continue in faith, love, and holiness, gathering it all into maturity. You can depend on this.Ministers are to have one wife.

1 Timothy 3:12 "A deacon must be the husband of but one wife and must manage his children and his household well."

Since the church leaders in Ephesus at this time were men, this verse refers to the deacons as husbands. Paul wants male church officers to be committed to their wives. He is saying that polygamy is not allowed. This verse was not meant to exclude single men or women from serving as preachers in the ministry.
Conclusion
 
If women aren't suppose to preach in churches, then we need to find the appropriate Bible verses to back up this belief. The above verses do not apply. They were written to deal with different issues and addressed to the early Christian church in Corinth and Ephesus.

I did not write this post to promote feminism or to dishonor men. My purpose was to prove the fact that these verses do not provide Biblical evidence to keep women from preaching in churches. It's important that we don't twist around the original meaning of verses to fit our desired beliefs.

Just like men, women need to seek God's will for their lives. They need to do what He is calling them to do. Does this mean that women should go against the popular cultural views of the church in order to obey God's leading?


61 comments:

A Stone Gatherer said...

Shari what a great post! I love 1 Corinthians 14! I love the part about order in worship! I know that's not why you put it in there, but boy that chapter spoke to me last year! We have misinterpreted scripture for years! Thanks for helping people to understand they need to look at the whole context and cultural background to understand what Paul or any Bible book writer was saying.

Found said...

Well, I have to say I disagree with you on this one. God does have an order of things, one that can be seen throughout scripture, both by example and by specific verses. The order of men being in positions of preaching and authority in the church and in the home is God's perfect design. He saw the original sin that caused the fall of man- a woman, being deceived by Satan, and a man not standing to take responsibility, but rather letting the woman lead him into disobedience. I don't believe for one minute that God's design for women to be teachers of the Word to other women and children is a "lowering" or diminishing of the great things God calls them to do, whether it be in preaching or teaching or serving. But rather the differing positions within the body of Christ that men and women are to stand in are there so that ALL might grow. It's the natural course of sinful man to move aside if a woman takes over a position of authority. It's the natural course of sinful woman to seek to take over the positions of authority given to men, being unsatisfied with the calling God has for them.

I do believe there are Deborah's in the body of Christ, called to speak the Word, but even those, like Deborah, when under the authority of a man who WASN'T doing what God had for him to do, desired and spoke to encourage THE MAN to take up the calling God had for him, NOT TAKE OVER THE CALLING GOD HAD FOR HIM!

I say all this with conviction, what the LORD has taught me as I study His word. I disagree with your interpretations of those scriptures as being only applicable to those churches and those women in those times. But I respect your desire to know WHAT the Word of God says and to obey His calling on your life no matter what!

May you be blessed as you seek to take up your cross and follow Jesus daily!
sheila

Sher :) said...

Absolutely! :)

Tracy Berta-daughter to the King, wife, mother, speaker, writer said...

Shari,
Boy, this is a tough one, isn't it? I often struggle with this one myself. We have a female pastor at our church and I have thought about these scriptures....She is not the senior pastor. I agree with Sheila's points on leadership/authority and sinful woman trying to ursurp man's authority. But, I don't think this applies to teaching and preaching. Jesus tells us to go and tell the nations about the gospel. Should we not preach the good news to men? I think of Beth Moore and Joyce Meyer. And, look who first spread the gospel (to men)- Mary M.!!!

Shari, I have missed you! I have thought of you often and lifted you up in prayer, Sister.

Blessings,
Tracy

sharon said...

Interesting. I only want to point out one thing: Genesis 3:6 - Adam was standing right beside Eve when she took that apple. It was a joint decision..he followed her all the way to the tree didn't he? Its only later he had 2nd thoughts.

If that is supposed to be the reason why a woman should not preach, then it doesn't add up.

To the issue at hand...I believe that a woman is only under the authority of her husband. Think of Esther...she was under the authority of Mordecai; but should she have waited and consulted with all the men of Israel before going ahead to save their necks?
Same with Jael, Deborah, Rahab...the list is endless.

Teaching to just women and children is not lowering if that is what you are called to do. But it is important to find out from God the scope of the ministry He has given you.

OK Shari, I've gone on and on. Thank you for this post.

Amy L Brooke said...

I totally agree with you. I commend you for having the courage to write all of that out.

I was struggling on if I should write any about it as I know so many would disagree with me. I'm glad you were willing to step out there. I might still write on it, but time is short today....

It seems to me one of those things that honest Christians can disagree about. My challenge to people is to try to live consistently. For example, if women aren't allowed to teach men because we were so easily decieved, then why let us anywhere near taching Sunday school to impressionable 5-year-olds?

I love it that my church has come down on the side of allowing women to teach and be in leadership. Though, sadly, many left over the issue. (It is a nondenominational community church.)

Thanks for sharing.

sunflowerfaith said...

Very challenging post and very well written...God Bless You for tackling this subject!

Amrita said...

I agree with you Shar, I am of the same opinion about those verses altho I have many Brethren assembly friends who don 't practice this. We agree to disagree and have fellowship on common ground.

Vashonnte said...

i definately agree with you! and thanks for thinking about me while i was gone! i am back now i have just been so busy lately, I hope all is well I just wanted to say hello!

Lily said...

What a controversial subject! This has been a question I struggled with for a while. I was taught both ways. However, I do agree with your point of view.

In those days, women were thought as disrespectful. They were un-educated and learned mostly from their husbands (other than wife and mother duties). In church, men and women didn't sit together; they sat on opposite sides of the room. When they didn't understand something they would ask questions out loud, which was very disruptive.

There were many different reasons these scriptures were written, and I believe they were specifically for those times and those churches.

Sheri said...

I personally think that we just need to be under our husband's spiritual leadership - whatever that means. Your husband believes you should preach, follow him. He doesn't, don't.

thoughts?

The Forney Four said...

Jesus Christ never gave women the priesthood for a reason.... Motherhood is divine, sacred, and gets us closer to Him and our Father in Heaven than any other act. BUT that doesn't mean that we don't have a voice. Some of the greatest sermons and discussions I've heard and participated in have been from women, inspired by our Father's Spirit, bearing testimony of His living Son.

Carol Van Atta, Princess Warrior said...

Thank you for sharing about this challenging subject. I, too, agree that women can be gifted teachers and pastors with God's blessing upon them. I appreciate everyone who posted on this topic. Great food for thought and prayer.

Anonymous said...

Genesis 3:6 does say Adam was with Eve, but man was not deceived, it was Eve who was deceived and Man sinned first because he listened to his wife rather than leading by example. This may clear that up...

Genesis 3:12-19
The man said, "The woman whom you gave to be with me, she gave me fruit of the tree, and I ate." Then the LORD God said to the woman, "What is this that you have done?" The woman said, "The serpent deceived me, and I ate."

The LORD God said to the serpent,
"Because you have done this, cursed are you above all livestock and above all beasts of the field;
on your belly you shall go, and dust you shall eat all the days of your life.
I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel."

To the woman he said,
"I will surely multiply your pain in childbearing; in pain you shall bring forth children. Your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you."

And to Adam he said,
"Because you have listened to the voice of your wife and have eaten of the tree of which I commanded you, 'You shall not eat of it,'
cursed is the ground because of you; in pain you shall eat of it all the days of your life; thorns and thistles it shall bring forth for you; and you shall eat the plants of the field. By the sweat of your face you shall eat bread,
till you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken; for you are dust, and to dust you shall return."

I think I believe in what Sheri said about following your husband. But i think this extends further into the church and how the church should be run, as man is the head of the family and should be head of the church family.

I really am not here to dishearten anyone, but I believe we should follow God in the way that he has directed us. I am still learning and will continue to let God direct my thoughts and my life. Keep the comments coming!

dcloud said...

A woman can appoint themselves to preach the Word, but that doesn't mean it's right. We have to follow God's Word to the letter in regards to these matters and there is no provision for a woman to minister the Word in a pastoral position.

Barry said...

Shari,

Thanks for these reflections - they're interesting and helpful.

Can I ask a couple of questions:

1) You dismiss the situations in Ephesus and Corinth as localised problems and not universal, I guess you could have added Titus and Crete as well. But that covers a significant proportion of the early church - in other words - its beginning to sound like a church-wide issue. Back in 1Cor.11:16, Paul speaks (albeit of a slightly different issue) as a universal practice in all the churches. So to my question: how can you be so certain that Paul is speaking into a localised, enculturated problem, and isn't giving a universal guide?

2) When you quote 1Cor.14, you stop at v36. This is a highly significant place to stop - because in part you are disagreeing with what Paul is saying; and had you gone on to v37, this would immediately have created a problem: how do you handle what he says about those who disagree with him (to quote the Msg, "v37, If any one of you thinks God has something for you to say or has inspired you to do something, pay close attention to what I have written. This is the way the Master wants it.v38, If you won't play by these rules, God can't use you. Sorry." Two questions to ask from this:
1) Did you ignore v37-8 deliberately (please say no!)
2) How do you handle v37-8 in the context of what you're trying to argue?

Thanks

Anonymous said...

The serpent that spoke with EVE, got a voice and scripture says that the devil comes as an angel of Light. I believe that serpent is talking to the woman again and the men are doing just what Adam did. Stood and watched, then particiated in the act. The Word is the Word and you can not explain it away to fit your agenda. Women are doing something that the bible doesn't even declare. Jesus never chose a woman to preach. Mary was highly favored for a reason, she stayed in a woman's place. Though she was highly favored she too needed to be filled with the Holy Ghost. The church is allowing women to do what ever they want to do in the name of the Lord. But does God really approve this, or are we the church being deceived. Women have been out of order in a lot of things pertaining to the church. Why do you think we have this discussion. It because there are those who believe that God didn't call a woman to preach. Show me one woman in the gospels that Jesus told to go and preach and I will beleive that a woman was called to preach.

Kofi said...

The word of God is prophetic. It is written for all times and not just for a brief period of time. All things shall pass away and the word of God won't. Joel 2:28 only talks about the gifts of the holy spirit and not a calling to preach. Being an apostle or pastor is not a gift, it is a calling. I dont believe women should be allowed to preach. It does not make them less human but just the order of God.

Pastor David Martin said...

This is great post, and a subject that needs discussion. Thanks. I am preparing a teaching regarding women's minister and I wholeheartedly believe in the need and right for women to minister. THis post was helpful (love the message rendering of the Corinthian passage).

On another note, how do you get the verses to highlight and click through to bible gateway like that? I would like to do it on my blog. it is very helpful.

I am developing a Jesus Christ resource site with various Christian teaching resources and having click through verse like that would be great.

Anonymous said...

dcloud I agree with you totally. We must not assume that at that time maybe that culture was diffeent Maybe is a very dangerous word as God does not deal with maybes. It clearly states women should not be in this position regardless of if they feel they can preach. Once again it is our interpretation that we seek and not the author which can cause many problems within churches today. The word of God is not compromised to suit mans carnal desires. Women must know there place Men also. It is so easy to agree and justify especially as there seems to be many gifted women of God who we are fed (the word by) but that does not make them standing on the pulpit right.......

Ylenia said...

Hello, I'm from Italy. I agree with you Shari, but you said that you should do what your husband decide on you. So what happens if your husband is not a believer? Is this rule valid? Thanks.

Pastor David Martin said...

Hi there, my wife and I run the http://www.jesuschrist.co.uk blog in the UK and I have just been posting a series of articles about women in ministry. In my research for the subject I cam across your site and just wanted to say what a great help it was as I formulated the thoughts I wanted to express. It is not an easy subject because which ever way you lean someone will misunderstand your motives, and I think that your heart for proper balanced, yet liberated, women's ministry, really comes across.

kwbeetham said...

Kenion - I clearly believe that women may preach in the church, in the scriptures (Acts 18:25-26), we see women who were prophets etc., we saw where Aquilla and Precilla took Apollos unto themselves, who was supposedly mighhty in the scriptures, and they expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly, this clearly indicates that they taught him. Additionaly, in Galations 3:28 it says there is no longer male nor female, but we're all one in Christ Jesus, in other words, this will not hinder the workl of the Holy Spirit in our lives. That's all for tonight : email me at kwbeetham@gmail.com

Diego said...

found I totally agree with you and I truly praise God for women like you. Many of you talked about the culture and moment of that time. Culture and time has nothing to do with why God placed the 66 books of the bible that we have today. 2 Timothy 3:16 says, All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness. Teaching in the church and sharing the gospel are two totally different things. Women teaching other women is acceptable, its all about the structure of the church and Adam was led by Eve, it was not a joint decision, I have no idea where you got that assumption. The bible is very clear and we can´t make up our own interpretations. May the Lord bless you all.

Whitney Genee said...

I am writing a paper on how I think women should be able to preach, and this has been helpful. I whole-heartedly believe the Scriptures, and I think sometimes we have to look deeper to find the meanings of certain- what we might call- sticky passages. The Holy Spirit gives spiritual gifts to everyone, male and female, and one of those gifts is teaching (1 Corinthians 12). We certainly can't fathom the mind and thoughts of God, but I don't see why He would call a woman into something if He wouldn't allow her to do it. I believe if God has given a woman the gift of teaching, the ability to preach, and He is tugging at her heartstrings, then I think she should go prayerfully forward all the way.

Blessings

Naftro said...

Well, its a good argument you have posted but with all due respect i disagree with you.
My underline reason for disagreeing is because am convinced that is not what the Bible teaches.
Let me ask this question to all women you preaches and teachers in the church in the presents of men....how do you feel when you are preaching to them....what is your motive behind all that? Is it that you want to be authoritative?
I do agree that there are so many God given ministries that women can do....i also agree that women are to preach [witness] to men who are unsaved but in the order of the worship the bible does clearly say that women are to keep silent. Man is the authority over man and not the source. Coz to preach is exercising authority.
Anyway, am glad that you all are giving your best to study the word of God and to correctly handle the truth.
To all the women out there.....you dont have to be a preacher or teacher in the presence of man to be accepted but God, just be thankful that your have been of great help to the man.
May the good Lord give you peace and understanding as you study his words.
God bless

brad said...

You said there were many false religions in Epheses and that these false religions were being led by woman. You also said that the reason Paul orderd the woman to keep silent in the church and not to preach was probably becasue he was concerend about the woman taking over the church with false religions. If this is true or not it does not matter becasue of 2nd Timothy 3:16. There Paul says that all scripture is given by the insperation of God and is profitable for reproof,for correction, for instruction in rightousness that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

So if Paul tells Corinth and Epheses woman should keep silent, then he is also telling all congregations that woman should keep silent.The reason Paul told the churches at Ephesus and Corinth that woman should not preach is not important. What is important is that Paul said it.

I am not always good at explaining my thoughts so if you have questions please reply back.

Brad

Anonymous said...

Hello!

I just got done speaking with my Nana who is 70 years old.She was telling me about my great great grandmother Mary from Texarkana Texas, she was born in 1886.Not sure if this is historically correct but as my Nana tell it she was the first Pioneer woman to go off and speak the word of god. She has countless diary's of my great-grandmother quest and her hardships along the way . God led her to do this with 7 kids and as she called him a "sinner " husband as he drank more then he was supposed too. at that point in her life she wasn't sure if she could go on this quest god kept calling her to do , all said and done god made her a deal . and she set on her quests with no money no food only a horse and buggy.My only thought is how in world she made it to these places with out a map ? Only one way .. God led her to the people . I would like to post some of these diary pages so you can all see of what amazement I am in . to know that this young women with 7kids no money or food to go out and save countless souls and her document her adventures along the way . I believe that god made everyone to share the word of god. Even if its not straight from the bible , but a testimony is sometimes just as brilliant. When the bible was written it was when women had no voice and I do believe maybe that the book was altered with the times. All I know is that my great great granny was a great testimony of a strong god willed women and if we close our minds and open our hearts maybe us too can be great testimony's and save countless souls . thank you for your time in reading my little short story
God bless

Anonymous said...

Women today are making a serious error concerning church leadership. They can be leaders or teach in society, schools, colleges, home, etc. However, The church has specific guidelines outlined in God's word. Look, you can't change God's word if you try there will be punishment. The plain things are the main things and reading todays liberal mentality into scripture is very dangerous. Do you fear God? Fearing God is the beginning of wisdom. Warning, women should not USURP authority over a man concerning the church and home and our specifically our relationship with God. Please, Please, pray about this.

Nelly said...

I agree with what dcloud said. I believe what the Bible says and the Bible clearly teaches that women be in subjection. It doesn't mean that we as women are worth less then men, but we have different offices. The men are there to teach and preach the Word, while we as women are to be subject to them and stand behind their backs, pray for them. And I believe it's an honor for us. There is nothing wrong with teaching Sunday School to children or having a women's class, but it is soo wrong to teach men. Someone mentioned why we would be allowed to teach little impressionable 5-year-olds if not men; Well, I don't know if God thought about this, but this is just what I was thinking about. A 5-year-old's mind won't have such a hard time concentrating on the lesson because his teacher is immodestly dressed, while a man, if there is a woman preaching, and is wearing pants, or tight skirt, or a low neckline, or tight top, he will be tempted to look. But that is just my thought, I don't believe that was God's only reason for having written this order down. The Bible never gets old and it is written for us in today's world too. and the Bible still says, "But I suffer not a woman to teach nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." 1Tim. 2:12
One more question: why is there mostly women that post comments here about them preaching? Why would we want the office God has given to our brothers in Christ?

Claire said...

I'm sorry, but you're horribly wrong in your interpretation of these 2 passages - particularly 1 Timothy 2. If you look carefully, Paul's reasoning behind not permitting women to preach has nothing to do with the social situation at that time! The reason he gives is that "Adam was created first, and then Eve." He's pointing to the natural order that God created, that man has spiritual authority over woman. It's not a matter of gifting or what we perceive to be right and fair - it's a matter of how God created his people, and what he had in mind when he did so! And you may harp on about "calling" etc, but at the end we have to ask ourselves where we get our calling from, and the answer is the Holy Spirit. Problem is, he's the same spirit who wrote the bible! So we come under scripture, and we test it. It's so easy and tempting to form our own doctrine and desperately use the bible to back ourselves up - "oh, but it might mean this here. Oh look, this might mean I'm right." At the end of the day, and you have to admit this, you are clutching at straws - looking for exceptions to obvious biblical rules in order that you might maintain what is, in your eyes, an unsexist/politically correct environment. I urge you to put what the bible has to say before your personal convictions.

Julipad said...

What you are doing is admirable, but its simply untrue. 1 Cor 30-35 does talk about order, but it enumerates what the order is about. It talks of prophesying and the order it should be in.

Then it says in verse 34-35; Women should remain silent in churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their husbands: For it is disgrace for a woman to speak in the church.

How clear could that be?. A woman not speaking was part of the order. That is the verse that backs it up. Don't try to dilute the bible to make it more palatable to readers. That is the problem with us christians. This is the word of God, not a feminist propaganda. You may disagree with it, but don't lie about its basis

Anonymous said...

May I point something out? TIMOTHY (1 & 2) IS NOT THE WORD OF GOD, IT IS THE WORD OF PAUL. Paul wrote letters to these churches telling them how HE thought they should be run. I don't know about YOU guys, but in my Bible, the words of Christ are in red. If I literally interpret ANYTHING in the Bible, or use it to guide my life, it's going to be the exact words of JESUS THE CHRIST. NO ONE ELSE, not even Paul, has the authority to tell anyone what they can and cannot do. Galatians said " you are all one in Christ. " " the is no male nor female. " I think Paul couldn't make up his mind! Christ calls ANYONE to share his word to the masses, not just certain people.

Anonymous said...

I certainly believe this. if God calls you, to preach. I would suggest preach. John Wesley faced an issue with a woman named Sarah Crosy, who went to church (society) one Sunday and the circuit rider didn't show. Rather than leave Sarah knew the Bible well and preached. She wrote a letter to Mr. Wesley saying, " I did not know what to do so I preached. Mr Wesley returned saying, "Preach if you must".Women and Men preach if you must.

Minsiter Leon Hitchens said...

Hello. My name is Minister Leon Hitchens. Being a man minister of the gospel and most importantly a believer in my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, I must say that this issue is very disturbing to me. The devil has many tricks and traps to turn people away from God. To tell a woman who has accepted what she claim to be her calling to become a preacher,that the word of God says that she cannot preach, can cause her not only to turn away from preaching but also from the church. This is one of the most important decisions that anyone can make in their lives. The question is not whether or not a woman should preach or teach, the question is whose responsibility is it to tell them. I don't believe it is no man or woman place to tell them. If a woman says that God has called her to preach the word and in fact he did not, then rest assured that it will be God that brings HER OR HIM down. That is the way the Holy Spirit works. Only what you do for Christ is going to last. May God Bless You and Keep you is my prayer.

Anonymous said...

@ the Forney Four: I agree. In Leviticus God gave the priesthood to the Levite Men. Now this does not mean women can't preach or share the Word of God, but they should not take on the role of Pastor or Priest. I am not sexist but it is clear in Genesis that God constituted that woman would serve their husbands but they, the leaders of the house -- men, would toil for the food. It is this position of leadership that and representation of Jesus Christ that men and men only should be pastors once again not to say women can't give testimonies or sermons, just take on the leadership role. http://www.gotquestions.org/women-pastors.html

Anonymous said...

Women,
Please do not make the Holy Bible sound the way you desire. The Scriptures say it, and so be it!

When 1 Cor 14, 1 Cor 11, 1 Tim 2, etc are so clear, why do you still doubt? What pride of yours makes you question what is Spirit-breathed?

Apostle Paul- a well-learned man, a Jewish Pharisee, intelligent, knowledgeable in the complete Law of the LORD God, raised up in thedeep wisdom of the Greeks- when he says something, he means it!
I see a lot of influence of feminism in the West, and worse yet - even among the believers.

Please do not be a woman of Proverbs 9:13. If you do not agree, you are challenging the authority of the Scriptures, and the design of Christ's Bride.

And by the way, please stay away from the Message. Christianity is of middle-eastern origin. Americans are Gentiles too. Do not look at the Bible from a North American, Caucasian viewpoint. It is simply and plainly errant to do so.

If this post infuriates you, deal with it!

-guyfromnurburgring@yahoo.com

Anonymous said...

My favorite post here was the one about the scripture that says a woman should keep quiet because Eve was deceived by the serpent, then why are we allowed to teach children.

This is logical thinking.

Maybe it has something to do with the influence wives can have over their husbands. Like the scripture that says a man who is disobeying the word can be won by the chaste conduct of his wife without the word.

LiamBenIsrael said...

According to the Bible Blacks and HIspanics are the Real Jews. Women are not aloud to teach men according 1st timothy 2: 11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. Now according to the bible Paul told all the churches this law according to 1st Corinthians 14 verse 33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
PLease do not mix feminism with the bible. Learn your role and order with God But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
h God. 1st Corinthians 11 verse 3

Anonymous said...

I will say that I have to disagree with you. This is an issue that I too have struggled with.
I grew up in a home where my mother wore the pants in our house -my father was physically present but didn't step up to be the biblical role of what God calls men to be. Thus I grew up with a streak of feminism that said women have to be in charge because men are screwing it up. However, my family has a lot of problems. God has been opening my eyes through Godly men I have come to know at my church that being in subjection to men is no bad thing when they are men who are living as God intended and are not abusing their power -it is what he created us for, to be their helpers (that doesn't mean their servants!)

I agree with the point about Adam, Eve was in trouble and he just stood there. And this apathy is many a man's downfall and makes it difficult to grow into the womanly role God has called us to when men are not living up to their roles.
But I think it can take more courage to maintain our God given femininity and coming along side and encouraging our brothers in growth in their manhood than too take over their roles.
God created men and women differently (thank goodness!) but He did not create us to be meek -He merely designed us for different primary roles.

Anonymous said...

Man is the head of the home, and so why would it be different in the church? So I guess this means a woman should lead a nation too??? God has a calling for everyone and mine is with children... Women try to hard to take the place of man and Its just not for me!

David Marttin said...

I too feel strongly about this subject. It is great to find information about a shbject that needs to be discussed.

Check out the series of posts on my blog that may be of interest to those who have an interest in women's ministry:

http://www.jesuschrist.co.uk/the-word/ministry/womens-ministry-1-what-does-the-bible-say-about-women-ministers/

higbeej32@hotmail.com said...

I believe that those God is wanting to use to spread his Good news are not doing so!! God said that if they didn't spread the news that he would use the rocks to cry out. I can imagine when he created the rocks he told them to sit there and be silent. So if men aren't stepping up, then God has to use women!! Speaking about Rocks crying out, is the Mayan calender theory a way of rocks to cry out? God's Word will not return void, it will do what it was sent out to do one way or another!!

Paul said...

You use the word "probably" alot. It is definetly a sin to change the Word of God. The Bible is not meant to be translated to make certain people happy. The Message translation is a perfect example, removing the words where God clearly states sodomy and homosexuality is a sin, an abomination if fact. Some times the truth hurts people. No matter who it may be, it doesn't make it any less the truth. "The word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.” (Hebrews 4:12) also
2 Timothy 3:16–17

Anonymous said...

Was the rest of the old and new Testament written by man or God???? They wer all written by man! Inspired by God. You say not to listen to Paul yet you quote from his other words? Make your mind up you cant pick and choose what bits to use!

Anonymous said...

Why do you call scripture lies?? My Bible is printed in black and white, thats it no inbetween! God through Paul has spoken against women preaching, why? I dont know why i just try to obey, do you realise you are questioning Gods word? Maybe the fact that so many women want to argue with Gods word is the reason that women are forbidden from running a Church.

If you dont like my comments take it up with God, they are not my rules they are His.

Anonymous said...

Sadly, people depend on their own limited understanding of the Word and they do not dig in to the context and history of the circumstance. This was false doctrine going on and this has everything to do with why Paul said this. This has limited women and even caused them to agree that they are “less than” in many ways.

It is arrogant to think that ONLY men have been called to preach. To "go and make disciples" was not given to men only. It was a command for those who believe in Him to make disciples. To have the opportunity to "make disciples" someone must first be listening to the Word be preached. Romans 10:13-17 says "for “Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved.” 14 How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher? 15 How will they preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who [a] bring good news of good things!”16 However, they did not all heed the [b]good news; for Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?” 17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word [c]of Christ.

Are we to say that the Lord is going to WAIT on men only to answer that call?

Anonymous said...

Were are currently leaving a Church because one of the 4 pillars of the CHurch includes that women are not allowed to preach. I do not agree that it should be one of the 4 requirements. Gosh are not their enough Churchs split already and denomantions in the World. Don't eat this, Don't watch that, Don't wear that, Ugh enough already! I want freedom, that is what Jesus did for me set me free from the LAW and sin and death. If you are confused at all in life about scriptures and the understanding of them, here is my Word that God gave me 12 years ago. Confusion is from the Devil. Let it go and move on. Adam

Anonymous said...

Wow! Guess you don't believe every SINGLE word is "God-breathed", huh?
So do you only read your "red" words and ignore the Whole if scripture? The Bible is not a buffet where you can pick and choose the parts you like and leave the rest. You either accept every word as being inspired by God, or toss it All out. I have to ask... Do you completely ignore the OT as well? No red text there as Christ wasn't alive yet, although the entire Bible points to one Man... Jesus The Christ. And did someone even mention the name Joyce Meyer???
She teaches that Jesus went to hell. What?! Wrong!

"When he had received the drink, Jesus said, "It is finished." With that, He bowed His head and have up His Spirit."
... John 19:30.
By the way, "It is finished." is in "red".
I think you should maybe read Colossians 2:8. Just to name one if the MANY times we are warned to be on the lookout for those teaching false "worldly" doctrines. Good luck in your searching, but don't read the Word in an attempt to back up anything you want it to validate. Read it for what God says in HIS word...His instruction to us All. It is quite clear. He is not the one trying to deceive us. ;-)

Anonymous said...

So Corinthians and Timothy were written to address localized issues, and that means we shouldn't pay attention to the clear teaching of them. By that logic, we should probably throw out all of Paul's letters, as they were written to address localized issues, likewise Peter's letters (they were written to the dispersed Jews), likewise John's letters, and James' letter, as well as Jude's letter. All were written to address current issues at the time. I'm so glad we've attained wisdom beyond those people of the time, that we can move beyond the teachings of the apostles. The only question I have is should we also apply this logic to the teachings of Jesus as well. After all, He did say He came for the lost sheep of Israel. So we should probably not pay any attention to what Jesus said as well because that was meant for a different time, different place, and different people. Come to think of it, all of the Old Testament was in reference to the nation of Israel. So let's just get rid of the entire thing. Instead we'll insert our wisdom and understanding.

The line of logic presented in this article is simply an extension of the question the serpent asked Eve, "did God really say..."

Anonymous said...

In no way does Gods word authorize a woman to preach...The world has tailored Gods word to fit its wants, for a woman to hold any office in the church is sinning in pride for self gradifcation and should not be permitted. Please dont interput my thoughts as judgeing only God can do that, but folks read Gods word its there for all of us to guide us into his will, the world and the people have changed but God has not,

Anonymous said...

2 Peter 3;15-16
and consider the patience of our Lord as salvation, as our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him,also wrote you, speaking of these things as he does in all his letters. In them there are some things hard to understand that the ignorant and unstable distort to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures.

Anonymous said...

Shari, thanks for sharing light on the subject of women preaching. God called me to be an Evangelist when I didn't believe in women preaching. It was a big fight between me and God and He won. I am a living witness that, yes, God does call women to preach the gospel.

Becka said...

"Ministry" is so much more than merely preaching the Word of God from a pulpit. Ministry is feeding the homeless, taking care of the orphan and the widow, serving others, singing in a choir, singing in a band, opening your home for a small group, raising Christian children, and sharing what the Holy Spirit has taught you.

If God wishes men to be His mouthpiece to the corporate Body, more power to them. They will be held accountable one day for what they preach and how they preach it. But it seems as if the Good Lord has given all the other jobs in His Kingdom to the women. :) There is no shame in being the hands, the feet, the arms, nor the heart of Christ.

But like Paul says, there is no male nor female within the Body. Women are considered sons of God while men are a part of the Bride of Christ. Figure that one out!

However I do have issue with someone above who said women are not called to be priests -- three times, believers in general, including the women, are called a "royal priesthood" and "kings and priests" before God. In 1 Peter 2:9, and again in Revelation 1:5-6 and Revelation 5:10. This is not "male" exclusive. This is the entire BODY of Christ. Including women.

And if you think about it, Christ's death rent the Temple Veil, making ANY believer capable of entering the Holy of holies and come into the very presence of the Most High God by the blood of the Lamb. What is that if not a priest?

~~Becka

Anonymous said...

Lol at saying the fruit was an apple :p I do that all the time

Anonymous said...

I pray to God you learn Hermeneutic principals of biblical interpretation.

Grey said...

Interesting point of view but is it in line with the teachings of Elohim?

I'm a man and as a man I've been given authority from Elohim, to proclaim the good news, to preach and allow Messiah to teach through me as His righteous instrument (the righteousness comes by way of grace, not by my own works).

I've found many women to be wise and I've learned from them. I've found many to be foolish, just as many men are foolish. We are all sinners, and that is the truth. We are supposed to love our women just as Yahushua Messiah loved the assembly.

Could it be that women are prohibited to lead the assembly (church) not because they are unrighteous or because Eve ate from the forbidden fruit first but because some men just can't come to terms with a woman teaching them? By the way, the same can be true in relation to women learning from men.

If I listen to a woman preach the Word and it is good then what am I to do, what am I to think? Should I reject the good simply because it comes from a woman? Is it possible for a woman to be strong in the Word, stronger then a man (or some men)? Yes, I think it is possible. This doesn't necessarily mean that it is right (a woman teaching the assembly).

If Elohim commands that women are not to lead the assembly then so be it, we submit to Elohim and follow the torah of Yahushua Messiah. Why is it so important for some women to lead the assembly in the first place? Where does the motive come from? Is it a calling from the Holy Spirit or does it come from within?

Others have said that when in doubt do not doubt the Word and I agree. The Scriptures plainly state that women are not to lead the assembly. We all have our place in Messiah, let's be content and submit to each other, in love and patience and long-suffering (being slow to anger).

But if a woman does preach the Word then listen, and if it is good then praise Yahweh. If we truly follow the commandments of Elohim then we will arrive where we are supposed to be, i.e., the woman will come to realize (if she truly loves the Master) that her preaching may (and often does) cause strife and contention, and knowing this she will submit to Elohim in all humbleness and meekness and take her proper place.

We are all one in Messiah, neither Jew nor Greek, man nor woman, but we must follow the commandments even when we do not understand them fully. Women who strive to follow Yahushua Messiah are of great worth in this fallen world. They are often the strength that keep men going (after Messiah), ministering to their husbands and sons so that they will be strong in Yahushua.

They bear and raise the future citizens of the kingdom of Elohim, loving and teaching the little ones, encouraging their husbands, turning away wrath with kind words. They are peace makers also (preaching the gospel of peace) and are just as important as men are in the Kingdom of Yahweh.

As we all grow everyday in Messiah Yahushua, being rooted firmly in His hand and in His Word, we will grow in oneness by His Spirit. If the Spirit is with us there is no one higher or better, we all walk side by side in Messiah.

I pray for all the saints, that Elohim gives us His love, grace, and faith and that we don't allow disagreements like these to fracture the body of the Messiah. I also ask that YHWH give me a humble Spirit, that if He sends a women to me as a messenger I do not disregard her words simply because she isn't man.

In Messiah Yahushua.

Matthew said...

Shari, First of all, you cannot use "the messages" explanation of the Bible to guide your thinking on this matter. It is, at best, the opinion of Eugene H. Peterson and at worst a corruption of what God's word says and he will be judged for taking away from or adding his own spin to God's word.

Look at the literal translation of the Greek, it is reasonably clear that a woman is not to teach or have authority over man and Paul gives us the reasons for this, it is not a passage taken out of context, the reasons he gives explain the rule!

Did Jesus call any women to be apostles? Have there been women teachers in the bible since the beginning of time? And now this verse from Paul, it is clear that God does not call women to fulfill this role in His Church.

If a woman do not wish to listen to what the Bible (The word of God) says, does that make them a good or a bad example?

If you are a Christian, you believe that God inspired the writing of the Bible, that all that is in it is the Word of God and that it should be followed. You should not be trying to look for loopholes in the laws of God and writing articles that turn other good people astray, but instead use your time to teach women and children and evangelize your faith to them, these are not small and insignificant tasks!

Do not treat the teaching of men as something to be grasped and as the only thing that means anything!

Your Brother in Christ,

Matthew

Anonymous said...

You are part of the luke warm Apostate Church, get right with God now, the time is short!

Murray said...

Dear Anonymous read 1 Corinthians 14:37... and pray for understanding.

louis Berard said...

You have the spirit of EVE, that's for sure. You try and twist and interpret scripture to satisfy your own worldly desires which are un-godly/un biblical. Women are not called to preach. Stop rebelling against God's clear direction. Women are not to teach/preach because they are susceptible to deception. Pretty clear what Paul says. It' no accident that most women "preachers" preach an un-holy false sinful liberal doctrine, or in the case of someone like Joyce Meyers who preaches a false prosperity message. Your ears have been "tickled," and you in turn are tickling other people's ears. Women were not created to lead men, and it is Biblically clear that they are not to Teach biblical doctrine. Stop opposing God and repent.